The Gibson J-200 sound ... for £250

Hints and tips on getting the sound you want.
Includes anything to do with Fender, Burns and other guitars; playing techniques;
also amps, effects units, recording equipment and any other musical accessories.

Re: The Gibson J-200 sound ... for £250

Postby dave robinson » 12 Apr 2012, 16:00

Martyn wrote:I've been casually looking at a possible acoustic purchase simply to record from at home and don't want to spend lots of money on something that will be used purely as a chord strumming instrument for tracks like Apache etc. If I could afford a Gibson J200, I doubt I'd buy one simply because the amount of playing it would get by me would be so out of proportion to its price. Cost per wearing, as my wife claims when justifying expensive shoes . . . :roll:

I recently trawled through several cheap to expensive options in a local music shop and most of their acoustic sounds, compared to electrified ones, were quite dramatically different. In my ignorance I think I'd presumed a pickup would simply magnify the acoustic sound resonating around inside this hollow box and transmit it to the amps exactly as I heard it, but just louder. Whilst some had a very pleasant strummed electrified tone, it bore little resemblance to that Apache strumming sound I was chasing.
I also found one or two cheaper guitars had more comfortable to play necks than a couple of the more expensive options -I have quite small hands and playing barre chords on some necks was almost impossible and at best extremely uncomfortable. I concluded that an acoustic with an electric-type neck would be a good combination and I'm still trying others in my quest for sound and comfort. I recall a couple of Yamahas and a Fender acoustic had comfortably low actions but others I tried had higher actions that weren't even adjustable so I ruled these out.

I'm assuming Bruce's recorded Gibson in those early days would have been miked to an amp, rather than having pickups fitted (?) so I wonder if owners of these fine guitars (and others mentioned in this topic) could comment as to whether or not it's possible to reproduce that same early sound using pickups. I discovered yesterday, much to my surprise, that the built-in mike on my Mac actually produces a very acceptable sound from a strummed guitar, albeit I was playing a strat unplugged so it was very thin sounding and the pick strikes were almost as loud as the notes produced :| (a bit of a Doh! moment and obvious if I'd thought about it) but as long as I recorded wearing headphones and switched off the speakers to stop their output being picked up by the mike, I could get a reasonable sound, albeit not the one I wanted. I recorded some experimental vocal 6 part harmonies, though, and was taken aback by the quality of sound I was achieving using Garageband's reverbs and a bit of EQ, given the built-in mike is presumably not considered of very high quality.

I've digressed a little but maybe I don't need an electro acoustic as such, when a less expensive acoustic-only guitar could be an option, given what I'm trying to do. :?


As an owner of a Blonde Gibson SJ-200 I will confirm that it gives THE sound when miked up and when not miked up. With the electro acoustic guitars it's a lottery and you need to try them - as well as knowing how to set up it's EQ to achieve somewhere near the desired tone. Basically you get what you pay for, which is why I bought the Gibson - and it makes me happy. I spent many year trying and buying an assortment of acoustic guitars and ended up with the real thing. As soon as you strum that Am chord you hear it ! :)
Dave Robinson
User avatar
dave robinson
 
Posts: 5274
Joined: 09 Sep 2009, 14:34
Location: Sheffield

Re: The Gibson J-200 sound ... for £250

Postby Martyn » 12 Apr 2012, 16:22

Oh Bum! I was really hoping you weren't going to say that, Dave, :( - looks like I'm going to have to save my pennies, then, unless I stumble across something else that will get me close to the sound I want.
I keep telling myself it's all about the journey . . . :)
User avatar
Martyn
 
Posts: 312
Joined: 16 Sep 2009, 21:14

Re: The Gibson J-200 sound ... for £250

Postby JimN » 12 Apr 2012, 16:47

Martyn wrote:I'm assuming Bruce's recorded Gibson in those early days would have been miked to an amp, rather than having pickups fitted (?) so I wonder if owners of these fine guitars (and others mentioned in this topic) could comment as to whether or not it's possible to reproduce that same early sound using pickups.


You've hit the nail more or less on the head. The early records didn't feature a guitar amp in the (acoustic) rhythm guitar chain at all. The J-200 (later J-30, J-45, B-45) was miked up (usually via a Coles condenser mike), with the signal being fed direct into the recording desk like a vocal or drum mike, perhaps via a Telefunken compressor unit.

Built in contact mikes and elements have been around since the 1960s and it was Ovation who started the electro-acoustic movement. A good system sounds better than a poor system, but even a good system is really only for the ephemera of live performance. For recording, you can't beat a high-quality microphone capturing the natural sound of the acoustic instrument.

Martyn wrote:I've digressed a little but maybe I don't need an electro acoustic as such, when a less expensive acoustic-only guitar could be an option, given what I'm trying to do. :?


If you were talking about an electric sound for lead guitar with a good sound for Shadows music and if someone suggested an Epiphone Les Paul or a Cort copy of an SG on the simple basis that it is less expensive than a USA Strat, you'd be unimpressed. You'd insist on the Stratocaster because you know that a substitute won't do the job. OK, you don't necessarily need to pay Custom Shop, or even USA, prices, but you need an instrument that is somewhat comparable in quality, and that puts a floor under the price unless you can source from an emerging economy where price has not yet caught up with quality. It happened with Japan. It has started to happen with Korea. It will eventually happen with China as well, but in the meantime, that country is capable of producing high-quality goods at low-quality prices.

JN
User avatar
JimN
 
Posts: 4559
Joined: 17 Sep 2009, 23:39

Re: The Gibson J-200 sound ... for £250

Postby dave robinson » 12 Apr 2012, 17:05

Martyn wrote:Oh Bum! I was really hoping you weren't going to say that, Dave, :( - looks like I'm going to have to save my pennies, then, unless I stumble across something else that will get me close to the sound I want.
I keep telling myself it's all about the journey . . . :)


I should add that i acquired a Gibson J-160e a few years ago and it sounds very similar to the J-200 and is considerably less expensive ( I paid £1500).
I have experienced the J-45 too and that sounds very similar, so it doesn't have to be the J-200 to be in the 'ball park'.
If I may digress I once owned a lovely Martin acoustic and though it had a fabulous tone, it wasn't the Gibson tone we hear on Apache et al and all those fabulous Everley Brothers records. I realised upon playing a Gibson that this was 'what it is'. It was difficult to afford, but I have now had the Gibson J-200 for nine years, after previously owning the Epiphone model of the same guitar, I can tell you it was worth every penny - sadly the Epiphone looks the part, but there it ends, as it has a totally different tone.
Dave Robinson
User avatar
dave robinson
 
Posts: 5274
Joined: 09 Sep 2009, 14:34
Location: Sheffield

Previous

Return to Guitars and Gear

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 15 guests

Ads by Google
These advertisements are selected and placed by Google to assist with the cost of site maintenance.
ShadowMusic is not responsible for the content of external advertisements.