So, which echo is the best ?

[ecca]

Interesting reading..........

http://www.effectrode.com/magnetic-delay/binson-echorec-memory-system/

[Didier]

In reading up about the Meazzi/Binson magnetic drum construction on Google it's not outside the bounds of possibility to make one ......
Iron/soft steel core, aluminium outer ring, 1mm dia. shellac wire outer, subsequently lathe turned flat........ hmm

Some of the turntables of yesteryear had such drums on a spindle that the drive belt fitted around to drive an idler wheel

Something like a old Garrard perhaps might be a good place to start looking for ideas

Many Thorens turntables have their 12" platter just put on a belt driven "drum" made of aluminium alloy. Here is one with the platter removed :



The one I have (TD150) is the same as this one. I have always thought this could be a good starting point for anyone wishing to built a Meazzi like drum echo unit...

Didier

[Hank2k]

Perhaps bruce wanted a place to put his keys, wallet and phone. Oh wait.....

[ecca]

I think an iron/steel core would be an integral part of the drum.
Good starting point.

[Twang46]

Interesting reading..........

http://www.effectrode.com/magnetic-delay/binson-echorec-memory-system/

Good link ecca, some very interesting reading there, more than just Binsons.

Dick.

[ecca]

I would still like to know how the wire is terminated.
Is it just many windings round the drum with the ends connected and then the whole winding ground ?

[roger bayliss]

I always thought that the head volumes on the F and J were different to the Meazzi Echomatic 2 ?

On the Meazzi Echomatic 2, I think the last head (longest delay) is loudest whilst the F and the J had the first head the loudest producing a kind of slap echo at the start of the repeats. The F and J would produce this first echo then the remaining heads would halo on after it, where as the EM2 would produce the loudest echo last and the halo would come before it. Two different types of sound and operation. Wonderful Land clearly has EM2 delay sound. The very early stuff had the slap echo type of sound (with halo) .

Regarding the echo on the records prior to Hank getting his first echo units I believe that is reel to reel slap tape echo done by studio engineers by using two tape reels and setting up a delay between the two. This was a popular way to obtain slap echo in the early days.

Might be wrong but that is what I believe a present.

The head volumes on the Echomatic 1 F and J machines were pretty much the same but differed from the model 2.
On the F and J the first heads in the chain were the highest in level decreasing in volume as you moved away from the record head with the last being the quietest. With the meazzis dependant on their design you would have the main regen heads, on the model F being 4 and 5 , i think maybe head 2 as well perhaps , the J being 2, 5 and 6, the model 2 being head 4,
On the model 2 the first two heads were high in level , the 3rd head at a slightly less volume then an increase in vol for the 4th head ( regen ) , as is known the first 3 preset playback heads could be variable in volume via the 10 k pot affixed to the speed control.

Prior to Hank using the echomatics i think it was reveb and not slap echo from the abbey road chamber.
Phil.

Thanks for that Phil it pretty much goes along with what I thought and clearly the head 123 level on the ME2 often means those heads were lower in the mix than head 4. I guess regen is another name for playback head ?

Some time long ago someone mentioned Hank having the same sound on a few earlier records prior to the ME echo arrival. I personally believe slap echo and abbey road reverb were used. Hank was a big fan of the early rock n roll slap echo aound so I guess he naturally tried it.

[phil kelly]

Hi Roger, no problem, As is known some playback heads are also used for regeneration ( feedback ) although at times the head selected for regen may not be engaged for playback,
Phil.

[Didier]

Some time long ago someone mentioned Hank having the same sound on a few earlier records prior to the ME echo arrival. I personally believe slap echo and abbey road reverb were used. Hank was a big fan of the early rock n roll slap echo aound so I guess he naturally tried it.

According to what Hank and Bruce said in several interview, when they started to record in Abbey Road, they just plugged their instruments and played, and had not a word to say about the sound which was fully the task of Malcolm Addey...

Didier

[roger bayliss]

It might be useful to read this article on early recording techniques

Interesting to read that due to the restrictions on number of recording tracks on the tape recorders that the sound had to be got before recording onto tape. Which would probably mean the musicians could hear the results before the recording went ahead to tape. So the guitar signal would have had eq, reverb, compression, etc added at the console before sending it on to the tape machines. Much different to the way recordings are done these days.

So the sound they got for the recording could be heard before it went out to tape by engineers and musicians in studio according to this.

http://www.jamcast.co.uk/early-recording-techniques/

Tape saturation effect and Studer J37 Plugin showing a real EMI Studer J37